Do We Need a Christopher Nolan Batman Trilogy?
Was 'The Dark Knight' good enough? Should we leave it at that?
Congratulations Christopher Nolan. You just delivered the best comic-book film ever. And creeping hell, it happens to be one of the all-time great sequels too. And did I mention it just shattered box-office records like a sledgehammer on a potato chip? What are you doing next…after going to Disney World of course? Oh yes, you might just attempt to break the dreaded comic-book film trilogy curse. Good luck mate, succeeding with that will make your accomplishments on The Dark Knight seem down-right pathetic.
After witnessing the cholesterol reducing* genius of The Dark Knight this weekend, a weird thought struck me. Do we need a third entry in Nolan's Batman trilogy? Don't get me wrong, we all want to see one. But should Nolan (who's technically not signed on for a third film, but I'd be shocked if he passed) risk soiling all he has rebuilt from the ashes of Joel Schumacher's napalm raid with another foray into bat country? Can we not just leave Batman Begins and The Dark Knight as one of the great one-two punches in cinematic history? Of course not, The Dark Knight was too damn good and made too much cash not to green-light The Caped Crusader.**
I don't think I need to remind you that a fully satisfying third film in a comic-book trilogy currently exists in the same realm of the Tooth Fairy and a talented Paul W.S. Anderson's. Superman III. Sucks. Batman Forever. Three words: Tommy Lee Jones. Blade: Trinity. I don't like vampires in my iPod commercials. X-Men: The Last Stand. Seriously, was that fucking Prince with the sonic hand-clap superpower? In my opinion the closest film to make a dent in a the curse is Spider-Man 3 – deeply flawed and lazy, but full of great action. Yet, not many are willing to even give it that much credit. After all, it's hip to hate on Spidey these days. Only when a third installment of a comic-book franchise gains an overwhelming consensus that it's worth a damn will I admit the curse is broken.
It's no coincidence that the suckitude of comic-bock film number three is inversely proportional to the ass-kickery of movie number two. With no origin story and a bigger budget, the first sequel allows the filmmakers to essentially blow their loads in both action and character exploration. Hell, Nolan admitted as much during an interview RopeofSilicon ran last week: "We certainly didn't want to hamper ourselves by saving anything for future films." And it's pretty hard to disagree with that statement considering how epic The Dark Knight is.
Nolan and company played it smart by waiting to break out the franchise's best villain until the second film – something most comic-book films don't do. Yet, part of me almost wishes they'd save The Joker for the third film. After the emotional meat grinder The Joker throws Batman, Commissioner Gordon, and Harvey Dent into, how can you top that? It'll be nearly impossible to raise the stakes that high again. And let's face it, we'll probably never see another Joker story in this franchise since no actor is stupid enough to jump in the gigantic clown shoes Heath Ledger left behind.
If a film is only as good as its villain, how can you beat Ledger's Joker? Like most people – SPOILER AHEAD – I thought The Dark Knight was setting up a Two-Face story for the next film – perhaps the only villain that could follow-up The Joker. Oh how we underestimated Nolan's ambition. Who knew he'd wrap the entire Two-Face arc into The Joker's story…and succeed wildly at it?
So now we don't have too many choices left. The Riddler is like a nerdier, less menacing version of The Joker. Mr. Freeze: great tragic villain, but too sci-fi for Nolan's world. And so is Killer Croc and Clayface for that matter. Catwoman would be interesting, yet Tim Burton covered the subtext of her relationship to Batman pretty well. Poison Ivy: nah. And Bane is pretty much a beefed up version of The Gimp from Pulp Fiction – although a leather daddy super villain would definitely be a first for a mainstream film. The Penguin, perhaps, but I'm only interested if they could guarantee Phillip Seymour Hoffman in the role. And then there's the Mad Hatter. Quite simply, fuck the Mad Hatter.
Perhaps the best path for the third film lies within Frank Miller's "The Dark Knight Returns." It's a radical idea, but just maybe Nolan should jump 30 years in the future and do a loose adaptation of Miller's masterwork. Several of the ideas found in Nolan's films would dovetail seamlessly into Miller's story (Batman gangs, Batman's one rule, Batman as an outlaw). And yes, I just said no actor would be stupid enough to follow-up Ledger's work, but The Joker in "The Dark Knight Returns" is 30 years older and that opens up new avenues for exploration. So recast the role with an older actor, and maybe you'll hit some sparks. Who knows?
Yet, that'll never happen. Not unless fanboys rise from their mother's basements and stage a coup at Warner Bros. However, with all of that said about the odds being against the third film, I have complete and utter faith in Nolan (with the exception of his debut film, Following¸ the man has never made a movie that didn't end up on my top-ten list). If anyone can pull it off, he can. The Dark Knight alone should win anyone's trust. Although if confirmation comes that Robin will cartwheel into the next film, be afraid, very afraid because Nolan has lost his mind.
* Not scientifically proven…yet.
** The rumors begin here on the third film's title. I'd love The Dark Knight Returns, but it carries too much baggage between Frank Miller's hailed graphic novel of the same name and Batman Returns. Although, I'm back to that in a second.
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Yeah I know what you mean, It's gonna be such a tough assignment to top TDK. As long as there is no Robin I say he should go for it. I am not even sure if the Joker won't be involved…if any one can fill Ledger's shoes it's Johnny Depp…I think he could do a fantastic job too…but they should perhaps show him as someone who is inspired by the original joker (heath ledger's) not act as the same person…you know? It's a tough sell, but in my opinion it could work.
Or they could bring two-face…we don't 'really' know if he's dead or not ya know!
Tricky one indeed.
A good villain is crucial but not the only ingredient needed.
I was so happy when I heard Venom was appearing in Spidey 3 until I saw how the film ended up. It just wasn't enough.
I'm a Marvel fan so not well versed in Batman villainery, therefore I have no idea who to consider.
Hasn't Catwoman allready been ruined?
I haven't seen the film yet but it just doesn't seem like a good idea to ever bring back the joker in this series (if it becomes one). Fans will compare and it will get messy.
A lot of things allso don't translate well from comic to screen hence the change from colourfull spandex to black leather with x-men.
So just like Brad said the Riddler for instance is just to weak of a character for the big screen.
And god no, no Robin. Or Batgirl.
I think he has to do another batman movie. The ending of The Dark Knight left it too open to not.
I think I would be satisfied, but let's face it there will be another one.
SPOILER AHEAD
Villian options: SPOILER: Is Two-Face really dead? Didn't he just fall?
How about bringing back Scarecrow?
Penguin is a good idea with Hoffman
How about Harley Quinn? I would love a good female villian.
Catwoman is probably one of the most recognized villian in the batverse besides the Joker, so she seems like the most logical choice. Burton did a great job with it, but that Halle Berry movie ruined it.
Aren't both MadHatter and Riddler variations of the Joker. So I would say no to both of them.
It always seems like the third movie is where the hero goes dark or maybe I'm just thinking about SM3.
To answer your spoiler question. Yes, [SPOILER]Two-Face is dead. Gordon was speaking at what looked like a public funeral. Plus the decision at the end doesn't have as much ummph or make as sense if Harvey Dent survived the fall.[/SPOILER]
I think Batman Begins explores all the themes that the Scarecrow represents. It'd be redundant..
Harley Quinn would feel like Joker-lite/retread if she was a stand-alone villain.
!!!!Spoiler Warning!!!
Sadly two face is dead but batman has a list of great villians (in my opinion)
the villians they can go with is problay Catwoman since there is no leading lady anymore since she rachel dies
The Riddler is an option probly another re-invented version and it might blow everybodies expectation away (look how everybody backlash when Heath ledger was signed in to be the joker then everybody praise him since its a different type of joker)
The Penguin aslong as they get Hoffman it'll be great
And what about Hush??? he might be great and it will fit in, in Nolan's Batman world
I agree No Robin or Batgirl
You're probably right, but I think it's going to be hard to top the Joker, it WAS best to introduce him in the second film.
People are speculating that it will be the Riddler because he was in the Dark Knight. I guess we'll have to trust Nolan, if he does a third one.
I thought about mentioning Hush…and he definitely would fit in Nolan's world…but he's sort of a weak follow-up to the Joker. Yet, who knows? It could work.
Everyone here makes good points but Nolan has already said he is not going to use the penguin because who is to unreal (imdb The Dark Knight trivia). But i feel that not many people understand what the riddler can be. sure he is kinda like the joker but not really like the joker says in this movie he just "does things" no plan, but with the riddler its all about plans and leaving little riddles everywhere to fuck with you andto try and see if anyone is smarter than him. the best way to view him in a dark way without reading the some comics is in Batman TAS the first one that had the riddler was called "if your so smart why arent you rich?" and that is a dark story and if they could make the riddler liek that but darker and fit the theme of the movies i dont see why not because he can be very dark. as for hush he has a good story i feel with a good twist to it so like what davidfrank said it could work. I have nothing but faith in Nolan and his brother to write the best sotry they can and it might take some time but im willing to wait. time will tell. also what happened to two-face to me felt like it was ment to be i couldnt of been any happier
I gotta disagree with that.
If you notice, no coffin is shown at the funeral. Also the decision remains the same. They dont want Harvey Dent to be a bad guy, essentially. If hes dead, then he can die a hero, in the public eye. If he survived, and is put away in Arkham in his own little private cell, then the decision has the same impact, as far as the citizens of Gotham are concerned…then they can have the inevitable escape….
I also think they MAY have alluded to Catwoman…
The conversation about his new armor, about if it would hold back a dog, to which Alfred said, "Maybe a cat…"
Just a thought…
Everyone can rest easy knowing that there will be no Robin. Bale himself said that if Robin pops up the next film he will chain himself to his trailer and not go on set. It is on ign somewhere. Also for the third film I like the idea of the Penguin since we are left with a "dead" Harvey Dent and a Gotham that is chasing Batman. The Penguin represents bureaucracy gone wrong and I think it would be interesting to see how that could pan out. If Nolan went that direction where the Penguin was fueling the flames of hate for Batman in Gotham. Also a new take on the Riddler could be interesting if they could capture his narcissism and fit him into Nolan's hyper-reality. Either way after a record breaking opening and rave reviews from critics and fans, there is no way he can not finish this trilogy.
When Gordan and Batman are on the ground next to Two-Face's body, Gordon says everything died with Harvey Dent. I don't think there is any question on whether Two-Face survived.
Good catch on the Catwoman reference. I didn't realize that until now.
Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade is the best of the franchise and thats the third film (and last film) in my mind. Also I think clayface would be pretty cool, although hes not as much of a central villian in batman as a few others are.
Not a comic-book film, my friend. Yeah and I'd love to see Clayface, but I just don't see him working whatsoever in Nolan's world.
Here's an idea. In "Batman Begins" Bruce had to save the people of Gotham. In "The Dark Knight" bruce had to save Batman (and the people of Gotham). How about have Bruce, save Bruce? What villain could be used? Well how about one that hates Bruce, that doesn't have super powers. "The Black Mask". Yes he's lesser known, but he's a "crime-based" villain that hates Bruce Wayne. So maybe the people of Gotham doesn't need Batman, but perhaps Bruce finds himself needing Batman once again. Then, perhaps "The Black Mask" hires "The Mad Hatter", which sorta happens in the comic book series, to make distractions to lure in the Batman, so they can kill Bruce Wayne (obviously not knowing that Bruce is Batman-which is ironic). So…. OK, let's have The Black Mask kidnap Alfred, and blackmail Bruce to perhaps kill Lew Moxon, who originally hired Joe Chill to kill his parents. The Black Mask does this for a couple reasons. 1) He knows Bruce has a personal vendetta against Lew Moxon. 2) Lew Moxon may be in competition with The Black Mask for power in the criminal underworld. 3) Having Bruce Wayne get convicted of murder would be great too. OK… So now lets throw in The Mad Hatter, The Black Mask hired him to make distractions by killing cops and whatnot by mind-manipulation techniques. So, Batman has to deal with that by means of obligation. But, he also has to deal with Lew Moxon, who perhaps finds out that Bruce Wayne wants him dead, so he hired Philo Zeiss, who is a genetically altered bodyguard (not super sci-fi, but borderline). So, basically this story would make Bruce Wayne split by duties. Does he deal with Lew for personal vendetta? Mad Hatter for obligation? Or The Black Mask who has Alfred? Therefore, we can start adding the infamous Rogues Gallery….
Good idea? or not?
For anyone that reads this site regularly you know I don't know anything about comic books outside of the films. However, from what I have seen that Black Mask character looks impressive.
I would also be interested in seeing Nolan's take (a realistic take) on The Riddler as well as The Penguin as long as it doesn't involve massive brain wave machines sponsored by Nielsen or penguins with rockets on their backs.
I skimmed over all of the comments and did not see anyone mention this villain…
But what about Deadshot. He could be cool cause Batman is not a fan of weapons and that is all Deadshot uses. It could be an interesting game of cat and mouse with him.
brad i can promise you that if they put the riddler in there it would be amazing because he has alot of stories with him. its just to bad they wont use freeze becaus eof him not being that true to life but his story has so much depth and darkness to it. but im telling you i read that Nolan saying he has no interest in using the penguin. also its mr fox that makes the cat remark jsut for anyone whos trying to catch it
I didn't get to see it three times like some people, but in the hospital room, didn't Harvey/Two-Face say that Harvey Dent was dead, and that only Two-Face was left?
Harvey can be dead all he wants, but that still leaves room for the Two-Face persona to remain.
My question is, will they be able to present the equivalent of the moral struggle that Bruce went through? I'd hate to see them simply recycle it, or do without. It was a large part of the movie from where I was sitting, so they need something similar in a third.
that is a very good point and observation. i agree, nolan should do a catwoman story…but should be very very careful to pick the actress to play such a key role such as they did with Ledger.
SPOILERS BELOW
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dont get me wrong the movie was amazing but think about this idea. they end it with the joker hanging his head out of the car window, dent in the hospital and the final shot is batman standing in the rubble. then we open up part 3 with the hospital scene. i LOVE the film the way it is but i think if nolan had really been loking to do a trilogy he would of gone along the lines of that. i think that it would be tough to do a third one because you would lose the political aspect that this one had and it would be a step backwards to "batman vs a villain".
That would have been fantastic, however it's a bit too dark and would have never happened. Fun to think about that idea though, it would have made it epic.
That sounds like a great end and start for a third. I was a bit surprised when the film didn't end after
–SPOILERS—
Rachel's death. If they had gone from the rubble scene to the last confrontation between Batman and Joker in the building and ended the film at the hospital, with the last scene between Gordon and Harvey where we see his burned face for the first time, and Harvey makes Gordon say Two-Face, it would have been amazing. Saved all the scenes of Two-Face going around killing for the beginning of the third and have Two-Face as the main antagonist. But then we wouldn't had had the "Because he's the hero Gotham deserves, but not the one it needs right now…and so we'll hunt him, because he can take it. Because he's not a hero. He's a silent guardian, a watchful protector…a dark knight." Maybe Nolan has already an idea of what he will do in a third film where Batman will be the hunted.
–SPOILER END—
TDK is definitely going to be tough to surpass, but the good thing is that it is not impossible. I have faith that if Nolan sticks with the Batman franchise he will continue to (hopefully) produce quality products. Too bad he did not briefly introduce Dr. Harleen Quinzel. because that would have been a great way to potentially flesh the character out in a third installment of the franchise. She could have been a psychiatrist that the police force brought in to try to get to the bottom of "who" is the Joker and then eventually face the Joker one-on-one when they are trying to figure out where Dent and Dawes' whereabouts. Her interest in him would have been subtle, and almost a bit flirtatious, as she becomes enamored by his warped mind. Of course that is if I were to have introduced her character in TDK. By the time the third movie would come out in turns out she has decided to take on the role of the Joker's personal psychiatrist at Arkham Asylum where he would attempt to toy with her mind. Little does he know that she is indeed infatuated with him and wishes to join, and even surpass him, in all that he has done. She becomes his own "harlequin."
Aside from Harley I would like to see Catwoman, b/c she iconic to the Batman universe and would be a great leading lady. Even though most people do not seem to think kindly of this femme fatal I think with the proper writing and direction Poison Ivy could definitely be pulled off. Like I said it is a matter of good writing and direction, and I have faith that Nolan with his writing crew could introduce her effectively. Maybe not as the main villain, but a cohort of sorts. In a way she resembles the philosophy of Ra's Al Ghul in that they are both to a certain extent environmentalist. However, with Ra's he prefer to only extinguish societies that appear to not be functioning, whereas Ivy would like to eliminate society on a greater scale. To a certain extent she is far more dangerous than Ra's. Honestly I would not necessarily portray her in that complete manner. I would feed off of the storyline in which she took care of Gotham's orphans. In the original story there was an earthquake and she transformed Gotham's largest park, that was once a place filled with trash (literally, figuratively, metaphorically, etc), into a safe haven for teh children that had no where else to go. To compliment Nolan's universe I would have Ivy be a well known scientist that was making breakthroughs with botany in terms of developing new medicines that could rebuild cells and whatnot. Since the hospital has been demolished by the Joker, Ivy would volunteer to serve at the hospital. While she's there she discovers that some of her serums might be able to aide a lot of these people with their ailments when all of a sudden another scientist by the name of Dr. Jason Woodrue decides to take credit for her discovery. At first she is able to maintain her stability, until she finds out that he has decided to bank off of her serum. Cost was never a concern for her, all she wanted was to help people, and now the good that she has created has become tainted by greed. Later she finds out that the good doctor has been altering her serum to kill people, a sort of anti-Dr. Kevorkian, and this drives her a bit mad. She decides to play dumb and share with him another serum that she is developing and without him realizing it he becomes the first test subject and then she begins to target all of his predecessors. I don't know … I'm just throwing something out there for others to consider and stem from this.
Whoops! I got too carried away with wanting a female villain that I almost forgot about these guys:
The Riddler: Only if he were to be portrayed in the way that Spacey's character was played out in Se7en. He would have to be very keen, cunning, manipulative and most of all calm. He would be the exact opposite of the Joker in his approach, but just as scheming and dangerous as him at the same time. It's all about the approach and who he's going to target. The Joker made it clear that he was like a "dog chasing after a car," whereas the Riddler has something in mind and even though it may be planned everyone will still be left stunned and traumatized.
Hush is a definite contender along with Black Mask.
it is possible that the hint-hint in the movie could have made an opening for catwoman, but for the penguin, scarecrow, riddler, or bane and ivy, i think that Nolan would go with another charactor that has never been done before. I dont think harvey dent is dead at all from a fall so he could bring something to the table for the trillogy. the third movie needs a brand new villian that has never made it to the big screen. if nolan could manage to direct the huge beam of attention away from the joker and onto some one new, then he could have a chance to break the 3rd movie curse. let's face it, would you have any other person to play Jack sparrow besides Depp? Ledger made the same cohesive conection with the joker and you cant reproduce that with anyone else.
I would go with scarface (the ventrillaquist villan) because it seems darker and its more reallistic cause he's not super human in any way and batman can fight him by hiself with no need for robin or batgirl. we all know the devistation of the other movies with the robin and batgirl feassco. Hey i wouldnt mind seeing that guy working in the bank at the beginning of the movie with the shotgun, show up in the third movie. i dont remember if joker left him for dead or finished him of before he walked away, but that guy is a professional actor and there has to be a reason why he would choose a movie with such a small part. I dont know. there's so many limitations since ledger died.
This is going to be a big post, sorry…
The people of Gotham already want batmans blood, he placed all the blame on himself over the deaths of the men Harvey brutally murdered. Why not have Riddler be dangerous in the next film in a different way (this is going to sound similar to Batman Forever, just not as cheesy). Have him know Batmans identity. The Riddler was always highly intelligent, so make him appear a hero to Gotham by handing over Batman to the people, toying with Bruce Wayne all the way. I don't mean let him expose Batman in the beginning but have him discover Mr. Waynes terrible secret and blow his antics wide open and outta proportion (making it seem a lot worse than it really is). Batman would need to fight for his place within Gotham, make people see The Riddler for who he really is: a manipulative, cunning, and evil criminal mastermind. Can Batman stop the false belief that Riddler is clouding Gotham under or will Gotham itself be Batmans reaper?
…I hope not :-SS
Have Riddler dress in a silk-emerald suit (darker greens) and gold custom '?' cufflinks. Have him with a trademark cane and to be a lot older than Bruce Wayne.
(Riddler knows who Batman is in this scene but Bruce Wayne doesn't know this. They are also at a public gathering (to make things worse) and Batman is about to be exposed…)
RIDDLER: "No, no, no… Realise Mr. Wayne, I see the problem, and the problem is about to be put to rest… This thing, it's been staring us all in the face for far too long… The people of Gotham deserve to know the truth, they deserve to know when they've been betrayed, they deserve fair treatment and no more lies, no more riddles. That's what they deserve…"
BRUCE WAYNE: "…what they deserve is a chance to find truth themselves, no smoke and mirrors standing in their way. You could never understand because you'll only ever find the truth in every lie you've ever told. In every question and riddle you claim truth but are only ever lying to yourself and that makes you a hypocrite."
(angered Riddler leans closer to Bruce and whispers)
RIDDLER: "…everything dark and light or black and white hey Bruce? No shades of grey here? That simple really? Well guess what?"
(quieter now)
RIDDLER: "…I know what you are…"
(Bruce backs off and looks in shock at Riddler, Riddler looks at him confused. Tension building as people look on)
RIDDLER: "Something I said must have startled Mr. Wayne. My apologies… (puts his hand out to shake, Bruce doesn't want to) …where was I? Oh yes… Citizens! Gotham will no longer live in terror of this Batman! The time has come for him to pay for his crimes."
(Bruce starts walking back keeping a close watch on Riddler while still being cautious of people around him watching)
RIDDLER: "TONIGHT! We will witness the birth of a new Gotham! One free of masked monsters cowering in the dark… Tonight Gotham is reborn! Now I do hate building suspense but… I must… I have been advised to 'milk' this ceremony! (everyone laughs nervously, awaiting the news) so keep watching… you may be as suprised as Mr. Wayne here, knowing what I know………. I know who The Batman is… and you soon will too! (everyone shocked)"
Or this even, how good would these sound?
Quotes that Riddler could say:
"I have a question for you, no actually more of a riddle. Why are the skies over Gotham so… dark?"
"[to Batman] I've always wanted to know something… if everything has at least one meaning behind it. Is there a meaning in what I call your 'maddness'?"
"[to Batman] Ask yourself something and riddle away your existence"
"[to Batman] I want to know one thing, how do you feel? How do you feel now you are Gothams villian?"
"Murder tastes awfully sweet… but, I'm more into the act of understanding… understanding a reason behind why I enjoy the desire to see people fail at getting away with it…"
We never saw a body or a funeral for miss Dawes, I hope she will have survived and will return in the shape of catwoman. Nine lives… She would probably be bitter that batman killed her fiance and went to save Dent instead of her at the explosion. Maggie would make the purrfect catwoman, she was phenomenal taking over from katie holmes. These films need more women in them!
First of all, leave the dead for dead. No more two face no more Dawes.. they're gone. The Joker is still alive and I hear they have some additional footage of Heath they might be able to use in film three… so tie up that loose end if you really have to, but as far as I'm concerned he can rot in his cell without another peep also.
Where to go from here: next up is the Catwoman. But not the obvious choices like Angelina Jolie… oh no. I want to see Reese Witherspoon be nice and nasty. She is so happy go lucky typically but when you see the few glimpses of her devious side it's enough to make you fear her and fall for her. She is such a talented actress and could really play out the prostitute side of Miller's idea or just be the classic jewel thief. Either way Nolan has some wiggle room to play with the moral dilemma of the sweet and innocent type of girl turning down right nasty when given the opportunity. Reese is the only actress out their in my opinion who is talented enough to give the Catwoman something she hasn't had before: the girl next door who just might have to hurt you if you cross her.
Likewise the only real choice from there is the Riddler (film Four). I say film four because the Riddler would seem redundant after the Joker, however with a little time and space he could be different enough not to seem like a knock off. But ONLY played by the charmingly psychotic Johnny Depp. Less cartoonish than Carrey and certainly has the playful yet sadistic side that we only slightly saw in Willie Wonka. Throw that in with the fore mentioned Spacey from Se7en sort of twisted puzzle resulting in death and you've got someone that might even surpass Ledger.
The ending is left much too open. i believe they're looking for a new one. Opinions: two faced is gone, too small a character in series to keep dwelling on. We need a new female role- possible Rachel Dawes coming back in a new guise (her death isn't certain. No body- no trace. Nothing. and her feelings with Harvey and Dent are cloudy. But we need someone new. Maybe Selina/Catwoman or Julie Morrison. Joker's not dead and neither is Scarecrow- but are at assylem where is when Dr. Harlequin enters series in comics, struggling to better understand them both after her own shady past. But Joker can never be redone and Scarecrows pathetic attepts in TDK took him out as a candidate for a bigger villian. I do feel another female is needed though- for Brue's sake. He's being hunted now and will have to learn to cope with being hunted and hated and at same time AND MOST IMPORTANTLY WHICH STILL NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED he needs to learn to quit hating himself and get over mistakes made. Brue needs to learn to live with Bruce, which he hasn't been able to do yet. He simply has overtaken batman to occupy himself from himself. Too much hurt. Perhaps a female's attentions or some self realization can help. Not enough resolution. I agree with bringing a smaller less known villian into play.
Oh and I agree against Robin and Commissioner Gordon's daughter is too young to be Batgirl (although I did like the twist that her paralyzation brought). Just because Harvey's gone doesn't need to take away from the political aspect. But a final Batman would/should open up questions of higher goodness and true responsibilities in ethics on a greater scale than simply cleaning up city crime. This one already started with that in showing that if given the right tools ppl can be trusted to improve their standard of living yet. there is hope in humanity to take over and not need a Batman (evidence of Ferry and batman imperrsonators). Let Bruce find peace in himself and humanity.
Ok sorry but lot of you are being pretty ignorant about dent… Harvey Dent is DEAD, just because they didn't show a freaking coffin doesn't mean he isn't dead. Harvey's Story wasn't suppose to be a major villian, the point of his character was to show that even the greatest good man can fall down to the darkness, and if you would just watch the ending, pay attention, and comprehend what happend, he was clearly dead… And theres a huge difference between falling on your legs(which maronis broke btw, least his ankles and such) And falling straight on your back…
That would break your spine or cause your heart to stop, something in that nature, and also note half his face was literaly burned off, so counting that, that kind of impact would kill him. Batman had armor, though that one scene where he jumped after rachel when joker dropped her.. He clearly should have died, thatw as easily 100-200 feet, even though he landed on the car and had armor, nothing broke his fall and that would be a instance death.
Anyway, lot of you are just ignorant about harvey, his character had a big purpose in the film. And he died, he will not be coming back… Hes DEAD, if he is alive they might as well cut off that entire ending, and remake the ending with joker. If you watched the ending, that was clearly a funeral for Harvey, the speech both batman and gordon made wouldnt have been made if Harvey was dead.. 2 key points were made at the end..
Harvey Dent, which was the white knight of Gotham, a true hero, Fell to the darkness when half his face was blown off and Rachel being killed. And he went mad, and on a massacre run. Second was that Batman broke his one rule, which was never to kill. He did, he killed Harvey to save Gordons son. Which brought his speech, and told gordon to blame harveys killings on batman.
And the part about Gotham deserves batman but not need him is true. In batman begins, Gotham badly needed batman. With league of shadows destroying gotham, and taking out the head of the mob. in TDK He wasn't needed, which caused Joker to appear to go after batman which caused many deaths.
Anyway… As long as Nolan is on for the third film and DONT decide to go.."Hey lets add some comedy to this!" Like the 4th Indiana jones..Blade Trinity, Tremors 3, TR3, those are just some examples. Then we see the ones that do badly.. If they can find someone for the riddler, and make him evil, and darker, as dark or darker then Joker with a good actor that would be great! However Jonny depp wouldnt be good for that.. Wanna know why? He isn't the scary type, hes more of a comedy, mid action type. We would need that can seem more darker.
Riddler would be the best to me, not some of these other pathetic villians.. We need realistic popular ones we can twist to a darker version.
Well what a great review you wrote there David I’m sure you won't be able to top this one when you write the next, honestly what short sighted arrogance on your part to assume that a movie that hasn't even been written yet won't be as good as The Dark Knight, yes the Joker is Batman's biggest villain (congrats on that assumption and a big pat on the back for you research is needed) he is an absolute and lives to create chaos and no other enemy Batman has in his rogues gallery is like him but to rubbish the others is pathetic, Batman has one of the best rogue galleries in comics and is the one of the most interesting of all heroes hence why all the best writers want to scribe stories for him ,perhaps you should of looked that up before you came on here wrote your little article to make yourself come across as someone who knows anything about the Batman ethos.
I couldn’t help but correct you, Spider-Man 3 is utter crap despised by purist and comic book fans alike, third movies in a series of films has plague 90% of all franchises in any medium but hey as you said the next Batman movie won’t be as good as the last I’m sure all comic book fans say that about the books that DC Comics publish well why bother making any more Batman books it won’t be as good as say The Dark Knight Returns (kudos David you actually reference it, you sound so much like you know what you’re talking about!) and Batman Year One.
Catwoman was covered with Tim Burton……….er no it wasn’t.
Selina isn’t as mentally unstable as Burton portrayed her in Batman Returns; Batman has always pursued Catwoman for other reasons than because she is a jewel thief, not because in essence she is a crazy Cat lady that Batman feels sorry for.
I think that comment undoes you the most David and shows your lack of understanding with Selina Kyle; she has never been portrayed correctly on the screen or was the section about where Halle Berry played her brilliant in the movie edited out by mistake in your article?
As I noticed you dismissed a lot of characters in there but liked the Penguin, why was that David? Was it because you have a fond memory for Burgess Meredith playing the part from the 60’s TV Show? What exactly is scary about someone with little man syndrome threatening people? How about someone with little man syndrome pretending to write an article about Batman that instead of being an impartial topic discussion decided to shoot down a movie that none of us know anything about?
I grant you that some of the villains in Bats Rogue gallery aren’t suitable for Nolan’s universe for Batman but the ones below are.
Bane (modified slightly yes) – Read Knightfall and don’t compare Bane to someone in pulp fiction, as that statement was the most pathetic line in your “article”.
Riddler – Done as in Hush, are you still with me David?
Catwoman – Done properly
Black Mask – A Goyer favourite and someone who hasn’t been done before.
Deadshot
Deathstroke – (modified)
Talia Al Ghul – I’m going to put Ra’s daughter as I’m not sure how familiar you are with comics David.
Returning villains.
Ra’s Al Ghul – “Death” is never final for Ra’s but you never saw him die.
Scarecrow – TDK cameo left a lot of people wanting more from him.
Two-Face – Maybe he will come back in flashbacks who were the other 2 people Gordon mentioned that Harvey had killed?
The Joker – there is some additional Ledger Joker footage floating around maybe they could digitise him for a scene in the third which if they can put it into the story that would be cool.
In conclusion David any movie has the potential to be worse or better than the last, but if anyone can do it I’m sure Nolan can.
The title of a third film should be: THE CAPED CRUSADER.
The Riddler: No fancy green costume. That, for me, should be replaced by body art in the form of tattoos. Tattoos of question marks. Johnny Depp is the actor to play this role. I'd have him as a biker-type, covered in cryptic art.
One way in which Christopher Nolan could go about writing the new film is to consider the character of Anarky from the comic series. Sure, he's not as widely known as say the Riddler or Poison Ivy, but he does seem to represent something in the comic series that is very instrumental to Batman's persona. On one hand we have Batman who becomes the protector of Gotham City who fights for justice in order to rid his home from ensuing chaos, and on the other hand we have Anarky who feels he is the voice of the people and uses this motive to take down corporate giants. They both feel they are serving justice but the two different ways in which they achieve this justice presents a moral question: Is one form of justice more important than the other. When I read the Batman comics I have always been led to believe Anarky is a self-rightous villian, when in reality he is simply doing the exact same thing Batman is: fighting crime and helping the innocent. It's fascinating to think of how this "villiany" is only implied due to Batman's ego, something which would be interesting to see him overcome on the big screen. This would be especially entertaining due to the fact that Gordon is now forced to publicly pursue the Batman and Anarky finds the targets of his form of justice in the news (in the comics he would know who to hold responsible for crimes against the people by editorial columns in the newspaper) thus making the Batman his prime target. If Nolan brought the movie in this direction it would not be to say that another main villian couldn't be present, perhaps Batman and Anarky are also pursuing the Riddler when not engaged in combat with each other. The only thing that would really hamper this kind of story would be the fact that Anarky's choice of costume is remarkably similar to V from "V for Vendetta", and would most likely be viewed as unoriginal despite the fact that one is not derived from the other. As I said before this story would be both easy to write and entertaining to watch, but I highly doubt that any suggestion of a story to Nolan won't be automatically dismissed. Let's face it, Hollywood does what Hollywood wants and without advice from your everyday simpleton.
Yes the name says it all. But only if they do him right. Robin can be done. And if anyone can do that character correctly. It's Chris Nolan. Yeah I know at his core, Robin makes a big bright red, yellow, and green blemish against the stark black and gray brooding Batman. But, give the Boy Wonder some credit. I love my Batman like I love the room when I go to sleep. Dark devoid of light. But y'know what.The Dark Knight is going to need a partner. If not to engross himself to being more of an outlaw when rumors rise of that side kick being a kid. If that's not going to piss off parent groups. I don't know what will. Especially a violent angry pre-pubescent(though I don't see that happening) in league with the man everyone (in the universe of the the Dark Knight movie)thinks killed those cops that Dent actually shot. He thrives off of being looked at as an out law vigilante who's seems to be as crazy as the creeps and crooks he brings down. He needs that edge. But if they put Robin in Pixie boots and or them green speedo shorts… I'll projectile vomit. Anyway. Hope I made a little bit of sense.
No robbin, next film, Batman is seen as the villain, and on stage…The Black Glove
What the hell are you talking about best comic book movie of all time? It Follows next to none of the source material. The whole I believe in Harvey Dent is from The Long Holloween in which Dent starts murdering Marone and Falcone's men, as Holiday, Waaaaaaay before he ever becomes Twoface. Holiday is then played by Dent's WIFE, I mean seriously Who the fuck is Rachel Dawes? Why Christopher Nolan, Why?
Oh million dollar one liners from the Joker that'll never fucking quit.