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The People Have Spoken: Letter Grades are Baaaaack

Hopefully this conversation has gotten us somewhere

I'm such a pushover aren't I? However, I think by not adding letter grades to this weekend's five movie reviews and having the conversations that took place on Friday and again earlier today we may have gotten somewhere when it comes to a complete understanding of the value of letter grades. However, I must say I never expected the response I received.

As of the posting of this article 210 people voted in a poll I expected no more than maybe 50 interested readers to add their input. But even more surprising is the fact 82% of those people wanted me to reinstate letter grades with my movie reviews. This is a number you cannot argue with, especially when people are making legitimate arguments in the comments section.

Here are a few comments that weighed heavily into my decision to bring grades back, on top of the poll results:

"Sometimes when I'm at the movies I go on to your site by iPhone and I used to see all the grades. Now it's difficult for me to use your site to decide sometimes because at one point there can be 3 or 4 movies coming out this weekend and if there and haven't decided yet it'll be a bit hard to choose." ~ MovieLover

"The grade allows me to get your general opinion on the film without robbing me of the joy of finding a movie's joys and thematic depth by myself. Then, once I have seen the movie and written a review myself, I can come back and read your full review." ~ John O'Neil

"I believe you should reinstate some form of grade, not necessarily a letter grade. so that we at least have the gist of how good/bad a movie is, without having to 'pick apart' a review." ~ Jeremy Baril

"While I do read most of your reviews, I do like the convenience of the letter grade, for do or die situations where there isn't enough time to read the entire review." ~ Cory

"We need grades so that we could personally know what we are getting without actually knowing its contents in the review…" ~ Topy

Beyond those statements, there is one major scenario I can identify with; here's an example…

Let's say you have no interest in seeing Zombieland, but at the same time you have a favorite reviewer that gives it a B+ review (not me, I only gave it a B-). Suddenly you are now interested to see what you may have missed based on the marketing and click over to read the review. If the review doesn't sell you, you can now go back to ignoring Zombieland, but perhaps something catches your attention and you're now willing to give the film a shot. In this case the grade served as a valuable jumping off point as opposed to being looked at as some final verdict on a film's quality.

I can also sympathize with the quick snapshot scenario in which someone may bring up the site on their mobile phone and look at the grades and go from there. Considering the argument to remove letter grades relies heavily on nothing more than seeing a select few emails and comments as a nuisance doesn't justify eliminating them altogether, ultimately eliminating their value to so many readers.*

Movie reviewing is not an exact science and the finality of a letter grade is something that personally frustrates me, but a lot of that displeasure has come at the efforts of a few that try to compare Movie X to Movie Y by letter grade alone. However, through the variety of comments, even by those that wanted the grades to remain absent, I noticed a lot of understanding about the value of the letter grade, which beyond a minor snapshot opinion is pretty much zero.

I still hope to come up with a different process in the future, but for now I have reinstated the grades and they can be found on the homepage, in all five of this weekend's reviews (find those here) and in the movie review archives. I just hope those of you that have shown understanding when it comes to the value of letter grades that you keep that in mind before trying to compare the "D" I gave one film and the "B-" I gave another. Neither film has anything to do with the other.

Thanks for all of your input. Seeing how I am writing these reviews for you, it's important for me to make sure you are getting what you want.

* I intend to keep my word and begin posting a weekend round-up of all the new movies coming out every Friday in an effort to give you one quick snapshot along with a few notes on each film.

Related post categories: Site Related Madness :

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Post #1
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Well, I can easily live with that, like I did the whole previous year of reading your site, and I perfectly understand you can't argue with 82% of the readers. But damn, those couple of days without grades were sweet.

- Nick
( October 3rd, 2009 | 9:26 pm )
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Post #2
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@Nick: Ha, it was quite the roller coaster wasn't it?

- Brad Brevet (Post Author)
( October 3rd, 2009 | 9:33 pm )
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Post #3
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Well, if you got rid of letter grades, then I was going to suggest getting rid of Oscar talk. IMO it is a lot worse than letter grades. Especially last year with, The Reader, The Dark Knight and Wall-E. This year I plan to avoid Oscar-related posts.

Anyway, it's still a cool site with or without grades.

- beautifulm
( October 3rd, 2009 | 9:36 pm )
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Post #4
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I have to admit I loved the days without letter reviews but 82% is a big number. Plus I still get to enjoy your reviews so its all good.

- John Debono
( October 3rd, 2009 | 9:45 pm )
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Post #5
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@beautifulm: Ahh, but M, you were a great addition to last year's Oscar conversation… You'll be missed.

- Brad Brevet (Post Author)
( October 3rd, 2009 | 10:04 pm )
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Post #6
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letter/star/tomato percentages are for stupid/lazy people. I'm not trying to offend anyone who voted for them but they don't really mean anything. Brad's review of A Serious Man is the perfect example; right now it has a "B+" and this is what the review says:

"If this doesn't come off as a complete review I apologize, perhaps this is a film slightly beyond my reach, or it is quite simply one of those films you don't digest all at once. Whatever the case may be I intend to revisit it again, something I have felt is necessary with so many of the Coens' films. Of the brothers' more notable efforts only Miller's Crossing and Fargo were an instant "get" for me, but as with the majority of Coen films a seed is planted making sure the film roots itself and grows inside you over time. I feel no embarrassment saying I need to see this film again to get a firm grasp, but I know in repeated viewings it's either going to settle to a happy medium or perhaps escalate and become an all-time favorite.

A Serious Man is a good film, but how good it is is yet to be determined."

The "B+" is as worthless as an ass hole on your elbow as they say. Brad doesn't know what the movie really is for him, the next time he watches it the B+ will almost certainly be an A or a C. the thought in the review are what matter. the grades are just a go to for people who don't feel like reading. And take away from the conversation reviews are supposed to start and or be a part of in the film community as a whole.

- Ross
( October 3rd, 2009 | 10:58 pm )
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Post #7
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@Ross: You bring up a good point, an excellent example and a good place to start as I have removed that grade from that movie and will elect to occasionally not give grades to movies on a periodic basis. A Serious Man is a film – my review quite clearly spells out – I have not yet formed a final opinion on so how can I possibly grade it? Thanks for your input.

- Brad Brevet (Post Author)
( October 3rd, 2009 | 11:19 pm )
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Post #8
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This is why I love this site. It is like a community, where everyone can be heard, and intelligent discussions can be had.

- chewbaca69
( October 4th, 2009 | 12:35 am )
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Post #9
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I have to agree with the John O'Neil quote. I like to get an idea of what some particular reviewers thought of a film (like you or Ebert) and then once I have seen the film for myself and formulated my opinion I enjoy reading the reviewers'. Hopefully bringing up the issue of letter or star grading has made it clear to those who try and compare films that way of the futility of doing so.

- The Bri-Man
( October 4th, 2009 | 12:45 am )
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Post #10
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With the letter grades next to the rotten tomatoes score, I can tell what's good, and what's bad, if I am on the fence for a movie. Most of the time they match-up (but for sure not "Invention of Lying". That movie will bomb, with a bad grade, but tomatoes is 60%, very interesting, and my paper gave to 3 stars. I find mixed reviewed movies more interesting.

- Steve
( October 4th, 2009 | 1:56 am )
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Post #11
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No you were write the first time. The words can speak for themselfs, the grade system you have or any grade system, is meaningless at the end of the day.

- Aly
( October 4th, 2009 | 7:07 am )
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Post #12
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Congrats on becoming a real critic again!

- adu
( October 4th, 2009 | 7:16 am )
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Post #13
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Hope this doesn't derail the potential inclusion of a bottom line/final thought.

- GregM
( October 4th, 2009 | 10:22 am )
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Post #14
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Never mind, missed the italics.

- GregM
( October 4th, 2009 | 10:24 am )
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Post #15
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@adu: I supremely disagree with you on this one. Grading a movie has nothing to do with reviewing a movie, it's an indicator and should be forgotten as soon as you begin reading the first sentence, and if you read the entire review it should never be considered.

- Brad Brevet (Post Author)
( October 4th, 2009 | 11:51 am )
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Post #16
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Thanks Brad!

- Keane
( October 4th, 2009 | 12:51 pm )
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Post #17
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Blimey, I'm off the grid for a couple of days and miss all of this.

It's been fascinating reading all the posts from this debate. I thought it was great you challenged us by removing the grades but I too am glad to see them back. I always your reviews in full because I'm interested in what you have to say and appreciate the sincere and thoughtful opinions. However, now I'm back in the UK it's often months before I get to see new releases, and the grades can act as a handy reminder – but they never were and never are a reason to see or not see a movie

- Helen
( October 6th, 2009 | 4:39 pm )
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Post #18
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I'm a big fan of the letter grades. I never use any site or reviews to determine if I'll watch something, (I always go by my own judgment, which very seldom fails me.) but I like the letter grades a lot. They're just handy. Sometimes I don't want to read a review, but I'm curious what you thought of a film, Brad. I'll just go to the home page and see "huh, Brad gave Zombieland a B-".

- Matt
( October 7th, 2009 | 9:55 am )
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